Discerning Scriptures
Hello Mr. Vinson,
I had a question about these verses:Rom 9:6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel.
Rom 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:Which Israel is Paul referring to in Rom 11:26?
Also I seem to have trouble with this distinction in the prophets as well. Take these verses for example:Zec 8:22 Yea, many people and strong nations shall come to seek the LORD of hosts in Jerusalem, and to pray before the LORD.
Zec 8:23 Thus saith the LORD of hosts; In those days it shall come to pass, that ten men shall take hold out of all languages of the nations, even shall take hold of the skirt of him that is a Jew, saying, We will go with you: for we have heard that God is with you.How do you discern if this prophecy is to physical or spiritual Jews?
Lastly, is Genesis chapters 41-50 a type of the lake of fire or the events in the tribulation leading up to Christs second advent?
Thanks,
J____
Hi J____,
Thank you for your question. You quote Rom 11:
Rom 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
And you ask:
Which Israel is Paul referring to in Rom 11:26?
In this present day of judgment, this verse certainly includes God’s spiritual Israel. Ever since Christ has become a spiritual nation comprised of all who are “in Christ,” and have been given “eyes to see and ears to hear, Israel has become spiritual in nature.”
Eph 2:11 Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;
Eph 2:12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:
Eph 2:13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.
Eph 2:14 For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition [ between us];
Eph 2:15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, [ even] the law of commandments [ contained] in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, [ so] making peace;
Eph 2:16 And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:
In Christ there is neither Jew nor Gentile, but contrary to the teachings of men like A. E. Knoch and the Concordant Publishing Concern, that is not to say that “in Christ” no one is either. Rather what “there is neither Jew nor Gentile” means is that all who are in Christ are now Jews spiritually. Gentiles “were in time past without Christ… aliens from the commonwealth of Israel.” But now that some Gentiles are “in Christ,” “he is a Jew which is one inwardly.”
Rom 2:28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither [ is that] circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
Rom 2:29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.
… and:
Eph 2:17 And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh.
Eph 2:18 For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.
Eph 2:19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;
Gentiles were afar off from the commonwealth of Israel, but now we are no more foreigners but fellowcitizens of the commonweath of Israel. Being Jewish and being an Israelite has, through Christ, become a spiritual condition, rather than a matter of physical pedigree.
But this chapter of Rom 11 is dealing specifically with this subject of who is Israel. As you have pointed out, Paul has already made himself clear, that “they are not all Israel who are of Israel… but in Isaac shall thy seed be called.” Paul makes it perfectly clear that when he says “in Isaac” he is not speaking physically, he is speaking spiritually. Speaking to Gentile Galatians Paul make this statement:
Gal 4:28 Now we [ Gentile Galatians], brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise.
Rom 11 is dealing with this new spiritual reality and Paul is assuring everyone that God will yet save all Israel, including those who are of physical Israel but who are “not Jews” and are no longer in fellowship with God because of their rejection of their own king, Christ.
Rom 2:28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither [ is that] circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
Rom 2:29 But he [ is] a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision [ is that] of the heart, in the spirit, [ and] not in the letter; whose praise [ is] not of men, but of God. Rom 2:28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither [ is that] circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
Rom 2:29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision [ is that] of the heart, in the spirit, [ and] not in the letter; whose praise [ is] not of men, but of God.
The whole world is blinded to the truth of these verses and still consider physical Jews and physical Israelites to be God’s chosen people. They are not. God does not have two chosen people.
Here is the verse in the Old Testament which clarifies the Truth of Paul’s assertions.
Eze 16:55 When thy sisters, Sodom and her daughters, shall return to their former estate, and Samaria and her daughters shall return to their former estate, then thou and thy daughters shall return to your former estate.
Your next question is:
How do you discern if this prophecy [Zec 8:22-23] is to physical or spiritual Jews?
There is no doubt that people of Zechariah’s time thought he was speaking of physical Jerusalem and physical Jews, but Peter tells us that this was not so:
1Pe 1:12 Unto whom [ the Old Testament prophets, including Zechariah] it was revealed, that not unto themselves, but unto us they did minister the things, which are now reported unto you by them that have preached the gospel unto you with the Holy Ghost sent down from heaven; which things the angels desire to look into.
Physical Christ- rejecting Jews will never hear the words, “We will go with you: for we have heard that God is with you.” All who reject Christ in this age, will “return to their former estate when Sodom and Samaria return to their former estate.
That is how I discern that Zechariah’s and all of God’s word are spirit and are therefore to be properly understood only spiritually. That is the very meaning of “comparing spiritual with spiritual,” and that is the only way the holy spirit teaches.” The natural man cannot do that:
1Co 2:13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man’s wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
1Co 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
Your last question is:
Lastly, is Genesis chapters 41-50 a type of the lake of fire or the events in the tribulation leading up to Christs second advent?
This subject is covered in both the paper entitled The Law of Moses Versus The Law of The Spirit, and a recent e- mail entitled How The Lake of Fire Is Administered.
The “second advent” is not a future physical event for those who know to “compare spiritual with spiritual.” It is physical and future only for those who have not been given eyes that see and ears that hear.
Heb 9:28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that [ “this generation”] look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.
I hope this has answered your questions, and I hope God will give you eyes to see the things of the spirit:
Joh 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you [ including Zechariah], they are spirit, and they are life.
Luk 24:45 Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures,
How so? He gave them to understand…:
1Co 2:13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man’s wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
Your brother in Christ,
Mike >
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