Do God’s Elect Partake of the Second Death/Lake of Fire?
Do God’s Elect Partake of the Second Death/Lake of Fire?
Can We Be Overcomer While in the Flesh?
Of late there has appeared a faction which insists we as elect must endure the second death/lake of fire and that we cannot overcome while in the flesh. There are a few at this moment who have not yet decided whether they must be hurt of the second death. Let the Lord’s Word show them who serves the Lord and who does not:
Mal 3:16 Then they that feared the LORD spake often one to another: and the LORD hearkened, and heard it, and a book of remembrance was written before him for them that feared the LORD, and that thought upon his name.
Mal 3:17 And they shall be mine, saith the LORD of hosts, in that day when I make up my jewels; and I will spare them [“shall not be hurt of the second death” – Rev 20:6], as a man spareth his own son that serveth him.
Mal 3:18 Then shall ye return, and discern between the righteous and the wicked, between him that serveth God and him that serveth him not.
The verse above is just one more verse which makes a distinction between those who are in the first resurrection and those who aren’t; between the resurrection to life and the resurrection unto judgment.
My words saying, “It doesn’t take weeks to hear the voice of the shepherd” were intended to exhort those who are still undecided to be diligent to seek to know all that has taken place in this heavenly battle, and to decide who is and who is not serving and being obedient to the Lord’s words. Just as Elijah told Israel, so I am exhorting us all:
1Ki 18:21 And Elijah came unto all the people, and said, How long halt ye between two opinions? if the LORD be God, follow him: but if Baal, then follow him. And the people answered him not a word.
1Ki 18:22 Then said Elijah unto the people, I, even I only, remain a prophet of the LORD; but Baal’s prophets are four hundred and fifty men.
1Ki 18:23 Let them therefore give us two bullocks; and let them choose one bullock for themselves, and cut it in pieces, and lay it on wood, and put no fire under: and I will dress the other bullock, and lay it on wood, and put no fire under:
1Ki 18:24 And call ye on the name of your gods, and I will call on the name of the LORD: and the God that answereth by fire, let him be God. And all the people answered and said, It is well spoken.
Paul tells us the same thing in the New Testament:
Heb 5:12 For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need that one teach you again which be the first principles of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk, and not of strong meat.
Heb 5:13 For every one that useth milk is unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe.
Heb 5:14 But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.
No one is demanding that anyone make an immediate decision, because we have no such authority, but like any true man of God, we are exhorting all of us to get off the fence and quit “halting between two opinions”. That was the intent of my statement, especially considering so many obvious heretical statements coming from the camp of Korah, who threw the consensus of our elders under the bus to maintain such statements as I have listed below. Ignoring the principle of ‘seeking a multitude of counselors’ and ignoring the admonition to “be persuaded of your leaders” (Heb 13:17) are both basic principles, which, when ignored, will lead us into error.
2Pe 3:17 Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.
1Jn 4:6 We [who abide in the admonitions of scripture] are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.
If God’s Word’s are ‘fire’, and that is a well-established Truth, then we have witnessed the ‘fire’ that came down in Elijah’s day taking place again after asking the same question, “How long halt you between two opinions? if the Lord be God, follow Him, but if Baal then follow him.”
This is just another way of saying, “If the multitude of counselors are right, consider that they are following the scriptural admonition to submit to that counsel, and consider the fact that those who are being obedient to the admonitions of scripture and have demonstrated a life of service to the body of Christ, just might be the servants of God.” Larry Groenewald, Steve Crook, Aaron Lohman, Tony Cullen, Bobby Lynch and I have served the Lord and His flock longer than any of those who have left our fellowship. Dennis Crabtree has been with us for only four years, but he has shown great humility in being corrected and admonished and has been gifted at seeing the inward spiritual application of the Lord’s words.
Here is a verse I referenced above which is being totally ignored by the other faction’s heretical teachings:
Heb 13:17 Be persuaded by your leaders, and be deferring to them, for they are vigilant for the sake of your souls, as having to render an account, that they may be doing this with joy, and not with groaning, for this is disadvantageous for you. (CLV)
Those are the words of the holy spirit in the New Testament which accord with “In a multitude of counselors there is safety”, and these are the words of the holy spirit instructing us to seek such counsel:
Pro 11:14 Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.
Pro 15:22 Without counsel purposes are disappointed: but in the multitude of counsellors they are established.
Pro 24:6 For by wise counsel thou shalt make thy war: and in multitude of counsellors there is safety.
Why would anyone who “trembles at the Word of God” ignore those words and loudly affirm to us seven elders that, “If [we] do not believe [their] doctrine, we will be in the lake of fire.” Those are the words spoken to us while we were discussing all of this before bringing this discussion to the church.
Ignoring those thrice repeated verses of Proverbs is to ignore a basic principle of scripture, and it will lead to error in doctrine and in life. No one came to us with a humble spirit saying, “We will abide by the consensus of the elders” though that statement was repeated many times coming from us, the seven elders. In a private skype just a few days after I first suggested we change the title of ‘Partakers of The Second Death” to Partakers of the Fire of The Second Death”, (which title would still have us living by every word, but doing so first instead of doing so in the second resurrection to judgment), only one man promised us that he would abide by the multitude of our counselors, but then he did not. The other three had always quoted those verses in Proverbs when dealing with all of our earlier detractors, but ignored those verses when they needed to submit to them. Like Korah, they could see that Miriam and Aaron needed to submit to the Lord’s Words, but Korah had more leaders siding with him than did Miriam and Aaron, so he must have felt the Lord’s Words were not needed in his case, and that the Lord’s words were nullified by the number of people who sided with him.
Here are the quotes from their paper Partakers of The Second Death: Part 2 which are obviously rank heresy, which anyone with the mind of Christ should discern in short order. Their words are in italics:
Page 38 of Partakers of The Second Death: Part 2, heresy:
“But each members flesh has to be done away with first to be in that Body, having that mouths of fire, Collectively signified as ‘lake’.
If we define it as ordinal, one will and can only see things Outwardly, will be, (our part in this book is removed).“
What incredible heretical statements! This is what the scriptures actually teach:
Eze 10:12 And their whole body, and their backs, and their hands, and their wings, and the wheels, were full of eyes round about, even the wheels that they four had.
Rev 4:6 And before the throne there was a sea of glass like unto crystal: and in the midst of the throne, and round about the throne, were four beasts full of eyes before and behind.
Rev 4:8 And the four beasts had each of them six wings about him; and they were full of eyes within: and they rest not day and night, saying, Holy, holy, holy, Lord God Almighty, which was, and is, and is to come.
“Before and behind”, means we are to see both ordinally and within. So we can see both inwardly and outwardly without having our part taken out of this book. It is those who cannot do so who are both adding to and taking away from the prophecy of the Words of God.
Page 43, heresy:
“For example, for us to be in the book of life….we have to be “always delivered unto [second] death”, so that we can be in the book of life , that is, that “the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our mortal flesh”.”
Defining the second death as death of the second group of men will mean Rev 20:15 and thousand of other verses are a lie. It may be hidden from some of you at this time, but it’s not hidden from some of us that there really is one event, not a ‘different but equivalent’ one as the first one.
It will mean there’s actually two events ALSO to get into the book of life.“
How does recognizing that those who were raised up to rule with Christ at the beginning of the millennium, having already been through the purging fire of the Word of God, make that erroneous way of looking at Revelation 20:15 a lie? Here is that verse:
Rev 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.
Those in the first “resurrection unto life” were “found written in the book of life” or they would never have been in “the first… resurrection unto life”. “That the life of Jesus might be manifest in our mortal flesh” proves beyond any doubt that these words apply to those with “mortal flesh” and not to those with bodies which are “raised a spiritual body” to be cast into the lake of fire/second death.
1Co 15:44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.
Rev 20:15 shows that the only people whose names were in the book of life were those who were the first to be judged in bodies of “mortal flesh”. In other words they were the “first” to die to their carnal minds. They alone had been raised up a thousand years earlier, and had been reigning with Christ in that thousand year reign. All the rest of mankind had never yet been judged and therefore must yet be judged in “the second death… lake of fire”.
Eph 2:6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:
Eph 2:7 That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus.
What Revelation 20:15 proves is that there are just two resurrections: one for those who judge themselves now in this age, and one for all others who are raised up to be judged in another age in bodies of spirit. This is explained twice in the scriptures:
Dan 12:2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life [first resurrection], and some to shame and everlasting contempt. [second resurrection, lake of fire, second]
Dan 12:3 And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever.Joh 5:28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
Joh 5:29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life [first resurrection]; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation [second resurrection].
This verse is true of both the first and the second resurrection:
1Co 15:44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.
Anyone who is not in the first “resurrection to life” is in the resurrection of damnation (Greek: judgment, lake of fire, second death).
The word ‘second’ is of course added to the verse referred to above (2Co 4:11). Here is what it actually says, and I will bracket in the words which really do make the meaning clear:
2Co 4:11 For we which live [in Christ] are alway [the first to be] delivered unto death for Jesus’ sake, that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our mortal flesh.
There is no “mortal flesh” in the lake of fire/second death, which proves that this verse applies to us who overcome our carnal minds while in bodies of “mortal flesh”, contrary to this false doctrine:
Page 38 of Partakers of The Second Death: Part 2, heresy:
“But each members flesh has to be done away with first to be in that Body, having that mouths of fire, Collectively signified as ‘lake.”
What total heresy which nullifies this admonition to us all:
Rev 2:11 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death.
The phrase “he that overcometh” is found after the admonition to all seven churches, and this new heresy wants you to believe “flesh has to be done away with first” before you can be an overcomer. Utter heresy!
This is what the scriptures actually teach about how one’s name appears in the book of life:
Dan 12:2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life [first resurrection], and some to shame and everlasting contempt. [second resurrection]
Dan 12:3 And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness [in the second death/lake of fire] as the stars for ever and ever.Joh 5:28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
Joh 5:29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life [first resurrection]; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation [second death/lake of fire].Rev 2:11 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death.
Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death [lake of fire] hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
So, yes, there are two events which are separated by “a great gulf” called “the first resurrection” to rule for the millennium. In the first event those who are raised from the dead are, along with Christ, preeminent in all things including being those who will judge the second group who are “cast into the lake of fire, This is the second death” from which those in the first resurrection are delivered by having been judged in this life:
1Co 11:31 For if we would judge ourselves, we should not be judged.
1Co 11:32 But when we are judged, we are chastened of the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world [to the “lake of fire/second death].
Page 48 heresy:
“There’s ONLY one Fire that creates God’s people and it is the process of judgment which is the lake of fire and which applies to the third part. Please diligently inquire those verses yourself. We are begging you all.”
Begging us to believe a lie may indicate sincerity, but it is still a sincere heresy.
The same two verses demonstrate the lie of that statement:
Rev 2:11 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death.
Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death [lake of fire] hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
Indeed the fire is the same fire, but it most assuredly is not the second fire which is why it is called “the second death [which] is the lake of fire”:
Rev 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
Page 50 heresy:
“Now what about the second group of the “rest of men”, “rest of the dead”, the uncalled and the many called today outwardly? (inwardly is fulfilled through our old man now).
These are the “two parts” that are cut off from Christ, yet completely dead in sins and trespasses. Simply speaking, it’s part of our lives that still need to die now, “ready to die” and we must die to. Remember, we are not saved all at once.”
Here is the verse where “the rest of the dead” are mentioned”. The mind of Christ will immediately discern the heresy in making verse five apply to latent sin in the lives of God’s elect:
Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
Rev 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
I believe in looking for the spiritual application of any words in scripture, but the only spiritual truth being imparted here is that those who are in the first resurrection, “the resurrection of life” (John 5:29) will not be hurt of the second death and “the rest of the dead [will] not live again until the thousand years are finished” and therefore will be hurt of the second death because their names were not in the Lamb’s book of life at the time of the first resurrection.
One lie always requires other lies to back up the original lie. In this case, the lie that the Lord’s first-fruit overcomers must be partakers of the second death also, leads to all these other false doctrines such as “we cannot overcome while in bodies of mortal flesh“ and “Simply speaking [the rest of the dead are] part of our lives that still need to die now, “ready to die” and we must die to“. What utter heresy! “The rest of the dead” are simply anyone who is not in the “blessed and holy first resurrection [who will] not live again until the thousand years are finished”.
Joh 10:4 And when he putteth forth his own sheep, he goeth before them, and the sheep follow him: for they know his voice.
Joh 10:5 And a stranger will they not follow, but will flee from him: for they know not the voice of strangers.
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