Rebuking A Brother

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Hi P____,

I am very gratified that you were led to our site and that you are in some way benefiting from reading it.

You say:

Understanding the verse you ask about here in Luk 17 will, without a doubt, help to settle your spirit, when you see what is meant by what is being said.
Most people who read iswasandwillbe. com for any length of time do become “troubled in spirit” when they start seeing what really is in the Word of God. It is a rare person indeed whose mate and family, not to mention all their friends, are able to see the truths they are seeing. So this situation itself becomes very troubling.
You ask about Luk 17:1-4

Luk 17:1  Then said he unto the disciples, It is impossible but that offences will come: but woe unto him, through whom they come!
Luk 17:2  It were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he cast into the sea, than that he should offend one of these little ones.
Luk 17:3  Take heed to yourselves: If thy brother trespass against thee, rebuke him; and if he repent, forgive him.
Luk 17:4  And if he trespass against thee seven times in a day, and seven times in a day turn again to thee, saying, I repent; thou shalt forgive him.

Does not verse three mention your brother trespassing against you? Yes, it certainly does, and yes, our brothers certainly will trespass against us. But is “thy brother” the person we are admonished to guard ourselves against? No, it is not. It matters not at all what our brothers do or do not do. Here is what does matter to you and to me:

Luk 17:3  Take heed to yourselves: If thy brother trespass against thee, rebuke him; and if he repent, forgive him.

What our brothers do to us, good or evil, is not our brothers’ doing, but it is the Lord’s doing, and it is for our good.

Gen 45:4  And Joseph said unto his brethren, Come near to me, I pray you. And they came near. And he said, I am Joseph your brother, whom ye sold into Egypt.
Gen 45:5  Now therefore be not grieved, nor angry with yourselves, that ye sold me hither: for God did send me before you to preserve life.
Gen 45:6  For these two years [ hath] the famine [ been] in the land: and yet [ there are] five years, in the which [ there shall] neither [ be] earing nor harvest.
Gen 45:7  And God sent me before you to preserve you a posterity in the earth, and to save your lives by a great deliverance.
Gen 45:8  So now it was not you that sent me hither, but God: and he hath made me a father to Pharaoh, and lord of all his house, and a ruler throughout all the land of Egypt.

Twice Joseph tells his brothers that they sold him into Egypt, but then he makes it clear that it wasn’t really them at all, but it was God who really sent him into Egypt.
So what we are being told is that God is working everything after the counsel of His own will, and when our brothers offend us, it isn’t really our brothers offending us at all, but it is the work of our Lord. If we know this to be true, how then can we hold our brothers and sisters, whether in Christ or not, responsible for what God is working in their lives

Eph 1:11  In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:

With this in mind, let’s look at how Matthew’s account presents this same story and how it emphasizes this subject of forgiveness.

Mat 18:1  At the same time came the disciples unto Jesus, saying, Who is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven?
Mat 18:2  And Jesus called a little child unto him, and set him in the midst of them,
Mat 18:3  And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.
Mat 18:4  Whosoever therefore shall humble himself as this little child, the same is greatest in the kingdom of heaven.
Mat 18:5  And whoso shall receive one such little child in my name receiveth me.
Mat 18:6  But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea.
Mat 18:7  Woe unto the world because of offences! for it must needs be that offences come; but woe to that man by whom the offence cometh!
Mat 18:8 Wherefore if thy hand or thy foot offend thee, cut them off, and cast them from thee: it is better for thee to enter into life halt or maimed, rather than having two hands or two feet to be cast into everlasting fire.

Both Matthew and Mark acknowledge that offenses can come from without, and yet both Matthew and Mark emphasize that the greatest concern is ” thy hand or thy foot [ which] offends thee,” and both say we need to “cut them off and cast them from thee.” Both Matthew and Luke use the phase “little ones” to describe those who Christ calls those “which believe in me.” But Matthew mentions the offenses as if they were coming from within and are in need of being “cast… from thee.” Mark makes the same point, and Mark also makes clear that the offence under consideration is coming mainly from one’s own foot, hand and eye. Again, here in Mark, this admonition is for those who “belong to Christ.” Neither gospel denies that others will also offend us and be offended because of us. But the emphasis is never on what is outside of us. The emphasis of all of God’s Word is always on that which is “within a man.”

Mar 9:41  For whosoever shall give you a cup of water to drink in my name, because ye belong to Christ, verily I say unto you, he shall not lose his reward.
Mar 9:42  And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.
Mar 9:43  And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
Mar 9:44  Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
Mar 9:45  And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
Mar 9:46  Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
Mar 9:47  And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire:
Mar 9:48  Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.

All three gospels warn us of this:

Mat 18:6  But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea.

From whom does the spirit warn us these offenses would come?

Mat 18:7  Woe unto the world because of offences! for it must needs be that offences come; but woe to that man by whom the offence cometh!

Woe to “that man by whom the offence comes? Where is the emphasis in all three gospels? Here is what the emphasis lies in the very next verse:

Mat 18:8  Wherefore if thy hand or thy foot offend thee, cut them off, and cast them from thee: it is better for thee to enter into life halt or maimed, rather than having two hands or two feet to be cast into everlasting fire.

You ask:

You know that it is not my intent to offend you. I want to “help you with your question.” But when any of us read what Christ says in Luk 14:1-2 and apply those words to Judas or our neighbor or our mate or any family member or any friend, we have forgotten that it is not they but we who are to “live by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of God.”

Mat 4:4  But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.
Luk 4:4  And Jesus answered him, saying, It is written, That man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word of God.

That is why the very next verse in Luk 17 says, “Take heed to yourselves…”

Luk 17:3  Take heed to yourselves: If thy brother trespass against thee, rebuke him; and if he repent, forgive him.

So let us establish first that this admonition is primarily to be applied personally. Look at how this admonition applies to Christ’s own disciples:

Mat 26:31  Then saith Jesus unto them, All ye shall be offended because of me this night: for it is written, I will smite the shepherd, and the sheep of the flock shall be scattered abroad.

The apostles are types of us, and we all are guilty of our Lord’s blood just as surely as  Judas and all the disciples were who denied Christ by fleeing and leaving him to his fate that very night.
So we need to be as merciful to those who deny us and who reject and forsake us, as Christ was to those disciples who forsook and denied Him. He even forgave those who were crucifying Him. Of course we now realize that in fleeing from our Lord, we too, are guilty of His blood and are guilty of forsaking, denying and crucifying Him. He died for “our sins, as well as the whole world.”

Luk 23:33  And when they were come to the place, which is called Calvary, there they crucified him, and the malefactors, one on the right hand, and the other on the left.
Luk 23:34  Then said Jesus, Father, forgive them; for they know not what they do. And they parted his raiment, and cast lots.

You and I are now the christ of Christ, and as such He is now living His life of forgiveness within us.

You say:

Believe me when I say that I know what you mean by that. But my sympathy does not change our Lord’s admonition:

Luk 17:4  And if he trespass against thee seven times in a day, and seven times in a day turn again to thee, saying, I repent; thou shalt forgive him

“Seven times” does not mean necessarily only seven times. It actually means as often as he sins and sincerely seeks forgiveness. Here is this same admonition in Matthew.

Mat 18:21  Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times?
Mat 18:22  Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven.
Mat 18:23  Therefore is the kingdom of heaven likened unto a certain king, which would take account of his servants.
Mat 18:24  And when he had begun to reckon, one was brought unto him, which owed him ten thousand talents.
Mat 18:25  But forasmuch as he had not to pay, his lord commanded him to be sold, and his wife, and children, and all that he had, and payment to be made.
Mat 18:26  The servant therefore fell down, and worshipped him, saying, Lord, have patience with me, and I will pay thee all.
Mat 18:27  Then the lord of that servant was moved with compassion, and loosed him, and forgave him the debt.
Mat 18:28  But the same servant went out, and found one of his fellowservants, which owed him an hundred pence: and he laid hands on him, and took [ him] by the throat, saying, Pay me that thou owest.
Mat 18:29  And his fellowservant fell down at his feet, and besought him, saying, Have patience with me, and I will pay thee all.
Mat 18:30  And he would not: but went and cast him into prison, till he should pay the debt.
Mat 18:31  So when his fellowservants saw what was done, they were very sorry, and came and told unto their lord all that was done.
Mat 18:32  Then his lord, after that he had called him, said unto him, O thou wicked servant, I forgave thee all that debt, because thou desiredst me:
Mat 18:33  Shouldest not thou also have had compassion on thy fellowservant, even as I had pity on thee?
Mat 18:34  And his lord was wroth, and delivered him to the tormentors, till he should pay all that was due unto him.
Mat 18:35  So likewise shall my heavenly Father do also unto you, if ye from your hearts forgive not every one his brother their trespasses.

That “same servant [ who] took his fellowservant by the throat” is you and me when we fail to let our brother’s offenses bounce off of us. We know “it was not [ they] who did it but God,” and yet we blame our brother, and hold him accountable for that over which he could exercise no control.
That is the real message in all the gospels. Your worst offender is not, nor ever has been, your husband, wife, siblings, children, friends or enemies. The worst enemy you will ever face in your life is the one who faces you every morning in the mirror.

Ecc 3:18  I said in mine heart concerning the estate of the sons of men, that God might manifest them, and that they might see that they themselves are beasts.

There is the beast of Rev. 13, and this is what that beast does:

Rev 13:5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty [ and] two months.
Rev 13:6  And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.
Rev 13:7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.
Rev 13:8  And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
Rev 13:9  If any man have an ear, let him hear.

I pray that you and I are both given ears to hear the warnings of scripture. It is given to very few.
To answer your question concerning how you handle others who may be offended that you stand with and for Christ and His words, yes, you are right to distinguish between those who claim to be brothers and those who are not. But in either case ask God for the wisdom to know whether you are “casting your pearls before swine.” Christ rebuked Peter and all of His disciples at times. He even called Peter ‘Satan’ on one occasion when Peter did not want to hear about Christ being rejected of the multitudes.

Mar 8:31  And he began to teach them, that the Son of man must suffer many things, and be rejected of the elders, and of the chief priests, and scribes, and be killed, and after three days rise again.
Mar 8:32  And he spake that saying openly. And Peter took him, and began to rebuke him.
Mar 8:33  But when he had turned about and looked on his disciples, he rebuked Peter, saying, Get thee behind me, Satan: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but the things that be of men.

That is our Lord’s example of how we are to rebuke those who can receive being rebuked.
“The things that be of men” are the smooth doctrines Peter wanted to hear. Doctrines which say you can “name it and claim it, and all you need to be blessed is to plant a seed.” On the other hand, who do you know who says anything akin to this statement of our Lord:

Mat 10:21  And the brother shall deliver up the brother to death, and the father the child: and the children shall rise up against their parents, and cause them to be put to death.
Mat 10:22  And ye shall be hated of all men for my name’s sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.
Mat 10:23  But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say unto you, Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the Son of man be come.
Mat 10:24  The disciple is not above his master, nor the servant above his lord.
Mat 10:25  It is enough for the disciple that he be as his master, and the servant as his lord. If they have called the master of the house Beelzebub, how much more shall they call them of his household?

We do not rebuke the world, and that includes the church which considers you and me to be heretics. We do rebuke those who are in our own fellowship, who claim to be of the same mind and who are “called a brother.”

1Co 5:9  I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators:
1Co 5:10  Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world.
1Co 5:11  But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.
1Co 5:12  For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within?
1Co 5:13  But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person.

“Do not you judge them that are within?” Indeed we are called to be judges, and yes, even now we judge what is within. “Judge not” is not said for the purpose of telling the saints that they are not to judge one another. It was said for the purpose of telling us not to be hypocrites in judgment, and it was an admonishment for us to be merciful in judgment …”for with what judgment you judge, you shall be judged.”

Mat 7:1  Judge not, that ye be not judged.
Mat 7:2  For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.
Mat 7:3  And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother’s eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?
Mat 7:4  Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam [ is] in thine own eye?
Mat 7:5  Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother’s eye.
1Co 6:2  Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters?
1Co 6:3  Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?
1Co 6:5  I speak to your shame. Is it so, that there is not a wise man among you? no, not one that shall be able to judge between his brethren?

It is not hypocrisy for a righteous man to call a sin a sin and to “judge them that are within.” “Do not you judge them that are within?”

Finally you say:

Again, I commiserate with you, and I know exactly how you feel, because I too, have felt that way, and my flesh still wants to “throw in the towel” at times, but that does not make it right to want to “not have them in our lives.” They are in our lives by God’s design and for our good. I know that you are aware that your life, with your friends and relatives who provoke you at times and who fill all your days and try you, are all “written in thy book, even all my days, when as yet there were none of them.”

Psa 139:16  Thine eyes did see mine unformed substance; And in thy book they were all written, Even the days that were ordained for me, When as yet there was none of them.

So I hope that what I have said will help you see that the emphasis of all scripture, including Luk 17:1-4, is directed more inward than outward.

Luk 17:3  Take heed to yourselves: If thy brother trespass against thee, rebuke him; and if he repent, forgive him.

There is an outward application toward our brothers:

1Co 5:11  But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.
1Co 5:12  For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within?
1Co 5:13  But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person.

But even here the emphasis is “them that are within.” Both Matthew and Mark emphasize the sins which are within over those that come from others. All three of these gospels encourage us to “take heed to yourselves”, and “cast them from thee.” This is Christ’s own summation of this entire subject:

Mar 7:15  There is nothing from without a man, that entering into him can defile him: but the things which come out of him, those are they that defile the man.

“Those… things” are “thy hand, thy foot, and thine eyes” which we are symbolically encouraged to “cast… from thee.”
His disciples asked Him to explain the meaning of this parable:

Mar 7:17  And when he was entered into the house from the people, his disciples asked him concerning the parable.
Mar 7:18  And he saith unto them, Are ye so without understanding also? Do ye not perceive, that whatsoever thing from without entereth into the man, it cannot defile him;
Mar 7:19  Because it entereth not into his heart, but into the belly, and goeth out into the draught, purging all meats?
Mar 7:20  And he said, That which cometh out of the man, that defileth the man.
Mar 7:21  For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders,
Mar 7:22  Thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lasciviousness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness:
Mar 7:23  All these evil things come from within, and defile the man.

So I want to encourage you to ask God to give you the gratitude and peace of mind needed to be grateful even for our daily trials. Sandi and I are certainly praying for you to grow to that point. It truly is a joyous and peaceful state of being when we can and do what James tells us all to do:

Jas 1:2  My brethren, count it all joy when ye fall into divers temptations;
Jas 1:3 Knowing this, that the trying of your faith worketh patience.
Jas 1:4  But let patience have [ her] perfect work, that ye may be perfect and entire, wanting nothing.
Jas 1:5  If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.

God loves you. You are “the apple of His eye”, and He is “working all things after the counsel of His own will, and He is working all things together for your good.”

Zec 2:8  For thus saith the LORD of hosts; After the glory hath he sent me unto the nations which spoiled you: for he that toucheth you toucheth the apple of his eye.
Eph 1:11  In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:

Rom 8:28  And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.

Your brother in Christ,
Mike

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