Deuteronomy – Deu 2:8-12 Our Old Man As Emims and Horims

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Deuteronomy Studies - Deu 2:8-12

Deu 2:8 And when we passed by from our brethren the children of Esau, which dwelt in Seir, through the way of the plain from Elath, and from Eziongaber, we turned and passed by the way of the wilderness of Moab.
Deu 2:9 And the LORD said unto me, Distress not the Moabites, neither contend with them in battle: for I will not give thee of their land for a possession; because I have given Ar unto the children of Lot for a possession.
Deu 2:10 The Emims dwelt therein in times past, a people great, and many, and tall, as the Anakims;
Deu 2:11 Which also were accounted giants, as the Anakims; but the Moabites call them Emims.
Deu 2:12 The Horims also dwelt in Seir beforetime; but the children of Esau succeeded them, when they had destroyed them from before them, and dwelt in their stead; as Israel did unto the land of his possession, which the LORD gave unto them.

Last week we went over how we, as God's people, bought meat and water from our religous old man, Edom. We studied how we possessed that land in type as our religous old man. Today, LORD willing, we will learn, after looking back further into our wilderness journey, how God brought us through our old man before he became religous. He is described as the "Emims" and as the "Horims". We see these things by looking back, just as John did in his Revelation of Jesus Christ in him.

Rev 1:12 And I turned to see the voice that spake with me. And being turned, I saw seven golden candlesticks; (2Pe 2:21-22)

This is the same principal that is being done now in Deuteronomy. We are looking back at our life's journey from God conquering the Horims in our land to give to the Edomites in our land and God conquering the Emims in our land to give to the Moabites in our land. This is all progression in our lives in the knowledge of God and the progression in our lives that keeps us blinded, both the positive and negative.

It says in verse 8 that we pass by our brethren, the children of Esau, that we learned who lived in Mount Seir, a hairy goat, through the way of the plain Elath and from Eziongaber.

Elath is from H359 and means - from H352 trees or a grove. And from the scriptures we know that trees and groves were where the apostate children of Israel learned to worship idols.

2Ch 24:18 And they left the house of the LORD God of their fathers, and served groves and idols: and wrath came upon Judah and Jerusalem for this their trespass.
2Ch 34:7 And when he had broken down the altars and the groves, and had beaten the graven images into powder, and cut down all the idols throughout all the land of Israel, he returned to Jerusalem.

It is in these religions of the world that we become self-righteous against all those bad people 'out there'. It is here in religion that God gives us the victory over our flesh, to establish and validate our religous self. He does so for a time to seek occasion against our flesh, to cut down the religious idol we have carved from the wood of our own tree.

Isa 44:14 He heweth him down cedars, and taketh the cypress and the oak, which he strengtheneth for himself among the trees of the forest: he planteth an ash, and the rain doth nourish it.
Isa 44:15 Then shall it be for a man to burn: for he will take thereof, and warm himself; yea, he kindleth it, and baketh bread; yea, he maketh a god, and worshippeth it; he maketh it a graven image, and falleth down thereto.
Isa 44:16 He burneth part thereof in the fire; with part thereof he eateth flesh; he roasteth roast, and is satisfied: yea, he warmeth himself, and saith, Aha, I am warm, I have seen the fire:
Isa 44:17 And the residue thereof he maketh a god, even his graven image: he falleth down unto it, and worshippeth it, and prayeth unto it, and saith, Deliver me; for thou art my god.

Then we pass by Eziongaber (H6100 - backbone like a man). It is here we learn the false doctrine of freewill, we stand on our own strength and support ourselves, the purpose of the backbone of a man which is to support his own weight.

Job 18:5 Yea, the light of the wicked shall be put out, and the spark of his fire shall not shine.
Job 18:6 The light shall be dark in his tabernacle, and his candle shall be put out with him.
Job 18:7 The steps of his strength shall be straitened, and his own counsel shall cast him down.

Amo 6:13 Ye which rejoice in a thing of nought, which say, Have we not taken to us horns by our own strength?

From here we turn and pass by the way of the wilderness of Moab. Each wilderness has its own name. This IS in its own right a wilderness, not The wilderness which is the lake of fire, but nevertheless a wilderness to the fleshly unreligous man. It is just a step we must all go through as part of our creation. One important point though, the Edomites and Moabites LIVE IN THEIR WILDERNESS. IT IS THEIR POSSESSION, and we are just passing through it. We have already been told that this journey will end when we are made whole in a symbolic 40 years. When the completion of the flesh has come to its end we are made whole. The Edomites and Moabites of our land do not have that promise, for they are temporal and made FOR US and our creation. They are like the Israeltes that died in the wilderness and did not rise from that death, for they represent the old man.

Num 14:31 But your little ones, which ye said should be a prey, them will I bring in (progression), and they shall know the land which ye have despised.
Num 14:32 But as for you, your carcases, they shall fall in this wilderness (more progression, as the children grow, do we die, as in the natural, as our literal children grow do we get older and die).
Num 14:33 And your children shall wander in the wilderness forty years, and bear your whoredoms (an Israelite that has not yet been given the dominion over sin), until your carcases be wasted in the wilderness (until the old man is dead).
Num 14:34 After the number of the days in which ye searched the land, even forty days, each day for a year, shall ye bear your iniquities, even forty years, and ye shall know my breach of promise.
Num 14:35 I the LORD have said, I will surely do it unto all this evil congregation, that are gathered together against me: in this wilderness they shall be consumed, and there they shall die (this wilderness is our lake of fire where the old man is put to death).

We must remember that God is The LORD of our lives, and He has promised an end to this wilderness journey. He will bring us into the promised land, we will have victory, we will see the truth in full, our old man will die, our man of sin will be defeated, and our new man will reign as a king in the promised land. These are steadfast promises that cannot be broken, for He Who promised cannot lie.

Tit 1:2 In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;

Before the world began He promised that we would be perfected, and that promise was in the creation of Christ, Who was created for us to be redeemed before we were ever created by Him. Christ created us TO BE REDEEMED, for He was Christ BEFORE He created us. His Father created Him as Christ, which His title itself proclaims someone is needing redemption. If we were not created needing redemption, then He would not have begun as Christ.

Eph 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ: ('In Christ' shows that we needed to be redeemed. If we were not in Christ and needing redemption, then WE WOULD NOT BE - period! If we did not need redemption, then we would be perfect from creation not needing anything or anyone to redeem us.)
Eph 1:4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
Eph 1:5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will, (predestined UNTO ADOPTION, we were created in the beginning stage of our creation NEEDING ADOPTION, NEEDING REDEMPTION. We were not plunged into hopelessness by the fall of Adam, We were created in Adam needing redemption, thereby having hope. The hope that He Who created us in this redemptive state, did it so that He could redeem us.)
Eph 1:6 To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved (Christ was Christ so that we could be accepted in Him. In His creation are we created).
Eph 1:7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace; [forgivenessG859 - From G863; freedom; (figuratively) pardon: - deliverance, forgiveness, liberty, remission.]
Eph 1:8 Wherein he hath abounded toward us in all wisdom and prudence;
Eph 1:9 Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself: (the good pleasure of His will was to create us needing redemption.)
Eph 1:10 That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ (the whole of mankind and spirits), both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him: (Both in our heavens and in our earth are we redeemed.)
Eph 1:11 In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will: (how did we obtain what we did not create? We are being created from creation needing a redemption to the inheritance for which we were created in The CREATION of Christ.)
Eph 1:12 That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ.

It is easy now to see how we are the praise of His glory when we see that Christ created us needing redemption. He literally created us... to be created... into His image by redemption from Adam. As in Adam all die, so in Christ all shall be made alive.

1Co 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

All of this is that progressive journey through which we all must travel for the praise of His glory. We must pass by the Elath in this progressive creation of our life and see it as a false worship under the trees and groves. The Elath is place of worship of my own self and my own self righteousness, a place where I worship an idol which I carve from my own life.

Mar 8:24 And he looked up, and said, I see men as trees, walking.

This place of Elath takes me to Eziongaber where, after carving myself into an idol in a grove, I try to stand under my own weight. We learn in these places that we do not have a righteousness, and we cannot bear the weight of our man of sin on our own backbone, the meaning of Eziongaber. So from here we learn the purpose of the wilderness of Moab - to defeat the Emims in our lives.

EmimsH368 = terror and HorimsH2752 = cave dwellers. When we put them together, we are shown how we hide in caves from the terror of the LORD.

Rev 6:14 And the heaven departed as a scroll (our heavens inwardly) when it is rolled together; and every mountain (what we saw as a high strength in our lives, freewill) and island (even the small things in our lives that protrude up out of our Adamic nature, we see as being controlled by The LORD) were moved out of their places.
Rev 6:15 And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man,(everything in us) hid themselves in the dens (Horims) and in the rocks of the mountains;
Rev 6:16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:
Rev 6:17 For the great day of his wrath (Emims) is come; and who shall be able to stand (able to stand on the backbone of a man carved out of wood)?

The Moabites and the Edomites are a terror of the LORD to our unreligious, lawless old man, who despised the things of God. The LORD created us to become religious, self-righteous, and judgemental for the purpose of overcoming our lawless Emims and Horims which are giants in that land at that stage of our growth. As Israelites we enter a land already prepared for us by our old man's religious Moabies and Edomites, so the land was prepared for the Moabites and Edomites by the Emims and Horims of our early life. The religious Babylonian doctrines that conquered my Emims and Horims, which represented all that was lawless and godless in me, were a terror to them. When I was first told about burning in a literal place called hell by an EDOMITE PRIEST, my Emim nature crumbled under the weight of this doctrine. It was by these doctrines my land was conquered BY GOD IN THE HAND OF THE EDOMITES! We all have stories of the depravity of our Emim and Horim nature, for that is what we were created to be at that stage of our creation. As at the tower of Babel, we were scattered for the purpose of dying to our old man and living to our new man. So the defeat of the Emims and Horims is not because the Moabites and Edomites are BETTER than them, but a part of our creation to be molded more into the image of Jesus Christ.

Remember the verse in Romans;

Rom 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.

We did not know we were Emims or Horims until we were defeated by the Edomites and Moabites. I did not know that I was a sinner per se until the Edomite priest told me I was. I did not know that my nature needed to hide from the terror of The LORD until I was told about His power to send me to hell in a false doctrine by the Edomite priest. I was conquered by this lie only for the purpose of creating the Edomite kingdom. All of this is a process of growth for the ISRAELITE. It is later that the Edomites and Moabites are also defeated by the ISRAELITE, Christ. He then claims victory over all, because it is revealed that He CREATED ALL IN THEIR OWN TIME AND LAND. Whatever possession they had, they had because He created them to have it at that stage of their growth. When the time was come, they were defeated by TRUTH, and that truth sends us into hiding.

Isa 2:19 And they shall go into the holes of the rocks, and into the caves of the earth, for fear of the LORD, and for the glory of his majesty, when he ariseth to shake terribly the earth.
Isa 2:20 In that day a man shall cast his idols of silver, and his idols of gold, which they made each one for himself to worship, to the moles and to the bats;
Isa 2:21 To go into the clefts of the rocks, and into the tops of the ragged rocks, for fear of the LORD, and for the glory of his majesty, when he ariseth to shake terribly the earth.

And;

Eze 33:27 Say thou thus unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; As I live, surely they that are in the wastes shall fall by the sword, and him that is in the open field will I give to the beasts to be devoured, and they that be in the forts and in the caves shall die of the pestilence.
Eze 33:28 For I will lay the land most desolate, and the pomp of her strength shall cease; and the mountains of Israel shall be desolate, that none shall pass through.
Eze 33:29 Then shall they know that I am the LORD, when I have laid the land most desolate because of all their abominations which they have committed.

The Emims, the Horims, the Edomites and the Moabites IN US all flee in their appointed time into dens, caves and any hole of darkness to hide from the truth. However, we must NEVER forget that WE ARE EACH AND EVERYONE OF THESE NATIONS. When we see this in us, we then fulfill this verse;

Heb 11:38 (Of whom the world was not worthy:) they wandered in deserts, and in mountains, and in dens and caves of the earth.

We must wander in dens and caves of our earth hiding from truth, in darkness of false doctrines of Babylon in us, BEFORE WE ARE GIVEN THE PROMISE. We do not know that the world in which we exist in not worthy of our calling while we are in the dens and caves of our earth.

Heb 11:39 And these all, having obtained a good report through faith, received not the promise:
Heb 11:40 God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect.

All these obtained a good report in deeds according to what they/we knew at this stage of growth. But all of it did not make them/us perfect because we had not yet come to the knowledge of the truth, for the stage in which we were created.

We are made perfect through the imperfections of each stage of our creation which Jesus Christ Himself created. We may have faith as Edomites and Moabites to conquer the Emims and Horims, but faith without the works of Christ is dead. The works of Christ in us, create us to be what He had predestined us to be, conformed to the image of Christ.

Php 2:12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.
Php 2:13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

Rom 8:28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.
Rom 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
Rom 8:30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

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