Spurious Verses In The King James Version
Greetings,
All praises due to the Most High God and our Lord Jesus Christ for his work in us unto salvation and a special thanks for our Father's work in Mike Vinson and the witnesses at IsWasAndWillBe. What a blessing to have been dragged this far and to this place.
I have a question about 1 John 5:6-11. My question is about those that bear record in Heaven (Father, the word, and the Holy Ghost) and them that bear witness in earth (Spirit, and the water, and the blood). I think what I need to know is how the "bearing record in heaven" relates to "bearing witness in the earth" and what is the relationship of those that bear witness in earth (the Spirit, and the water, and the blood) with those that bear record in heaven.
Please also touch upon the "water and blood" of 1 John 5:6 as it relates my question.
1Jn 5:6 This is he that came by water and blood, even Jesus Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is truth.
1Jn 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
1Jn 5:8 And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.
1Jn 5:9 If we receive the witness of men, the witness of God is greater: for this is the witness of God which he hath testified of his Son.
1Jn 5:10 He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son.
Thanks,
D____
Hi D____,
It is always good to hear from you.
You ask about 1Jo 5:7. I have cut and pasted from the part of Is God a Trinity? which deals with this verse in question:
It is always good to hear from you.
You ask about 1Jo 5:7. I have cut and pasted from the part of Is God a Trinity? which deals with this verse in question:
But How About 1Jo 5:7?
1Jn 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
1Jn 5:8 And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.
The answer to this question is certainly ancient history to any student of the scriptures who has progressed beyond the "If the King James Bible was good enough for the apostles, then it's good enough for me!" attitude.
Here is what the Jameson, Fausset and Brown Commentary (JFB) has to say on this verse:
"The only Greek manuscripts IN ANY FORM which supports the words, "in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost, and these three are one; and there are three that bear witness in earth," are the Monfortianus of Dublin, copied evidently from the MODERN Latin Vulgate; the Revianue, copied from the COMLUTENSIAN POLYGLOT; a manuscript at Naples, with the words added in the margin by a recent hand; OTTOBONIANUS, 298, of the fifteenth century, the GREEK of which is a mere translation of the accompanying Latin. ALL the old versions omit the words. The oldest manuscripts of the VULGATE omit them: the earliest VULGATE manuscript which has them, WIZANBURGENSIS, 99, is of the eighth century." (Emphasis is the author's.)
One should know that the three men who wrote the JFB commentary believe in the Trinity and go on to attempt to justify what they admit are "words added in the margin by a recent hand."
That is what is in the article entitled Is God a Trinity? When we leave out the emboldened words in quotations, here is what was in the original Greek according to the English Majority Text Version:
(EMTV) For there are three that bear witness: the Spirit, the water, and the blood; and these three agree as one.You asked me:
"I think what I need to know is how the "bearing record in heaven" relates to "bearing witness in the earth" and what is the relationship of those that bear witness in earth (the Spirit, and the water, and the blood) with those that bear record in heaven.
Please also touch upon the "water and blood" of 1 John 5:6 as it relates my question."
"copied from the COMLUTENSIAN POLYGLOT; a manuscript at Naples, with the words added in the margin by a recent hand;"
That being the case, as acknowledged by all, those added words do not bear comment. But the words "water and blood" of which you inquire are in the majority of the texts and I will gladly point out that Christ refers to His own words as "living water."
Joh 4:10 Jesus answered and said unto her, If thou knewest the gift of God, and who it is that saith to thee, Give me to drink; thou wouldest have asked of him, and he would have given thee living water.Christ repeats this parable of water being His word in John 7.
Joh 4:11 The woman saith unto him, Sir, thou hast nothing to draw with, and the well is deep: from whence then hast thou that living water?
Joh 4:12 Art thou greater than our father Jacob, which gave us the well, and drank thereof himself, and his children, and his cattle?
Joh 4:13 Jesus answered and said unto her, Whosoever drinketh of this water shall thirst again:
Joh 4:14 But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life.
Joh 7:38 He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.
That this is referring to both the spirit and the word as one is made clear in this verse of God's Word:
Here are some words which you quote in your e-mail which really are in the original:
Mike
Joh 6:63 It is the spirit that giveth life; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I have spoken unto you are spirit, are are life. (ASV)But let's look once more at how this verse which concerns you is worded in the Majority Text Version
(EMTV) For there are three that bear witness: the Spirit, the water, and the blood; and these three agree as one.
"The spirit, the water and the blood: and these three agree as one." So the blood is also a witness to what is said by the spirit and the water. Therefore the blood must also be said to be a type of Christ's words in the New Testament. Can we find such a statement in scripture? As a matter of fact we can:
Mat 26:28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.So the Majority Text is right:
Mar 14:24 And he said unto them, This is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many.
Luk 22:20 Likewise also the cup after supper, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood, which is shed for you.
(EMTV) For there are three that bear witness: the Spirit, the water, and the blood; and these three agree as one.
"These three agree as one." God's Words are spirit, and it is the spirit that gives life, and it was God's own Words which foretold the blood of Christ being spilled for our lives. "These three agree as one."
I hope that helps you to see the mind of God more clearly, and I hope you see clearly that the words 'in heaven" and the words "in the earth" in that verse were never originally in the Bible. I also suggest and urge you to read, Can A Lie In The Translation Be Weeded Out? on iswasandwillbe.com. That paper documents how this same lying spirit concerning the false doctrine of a trinity was forced into the English text in Mat 28:19. Check that out, and inform yourself concerning these efforts of the Adversary.
Here are some words which you quote in your e-mail which really are in the original:
1Jn 5:9 If we receive the witness of men, the witness of God is greater: for this is the witness of God which he hath testified of his Son.Words that are added to the text, are not "the witness of God." All who have a handle on the truth of this next verse, have nothing to fear about any efforts of the Adversary to mislead them:
Psa 119:160 The sum of thy word is truth; And every one of thy righteous ordinances endureth for ever.Your brother in the Christ.
Mike
